ETA: thanks for all the feedback and suggestions. Just wanted to add that my daughter does already wear boyleg undies to Kindy. I just use the terms for boyleg and y undies interchangeably, so that would have been confusing sorry. This was about seeing undies not about accidentally seeing vulva.
After reading comments I have bought her some little shorts she wears and am going to have a chat directly with teacher to ask over reasoning. Maybe it's a reason we need to be talking with daughter about too so will ask Kindy teacher. Thanks all.
Hi mums,
Had a convo at Kindy today, wondering how other mums would feel?
Hubby picked our 4yo daughter up today.
Teacher said "I noticed *child* really likes to wear dresses, which is fine. But could she wear some little bike shorts underneath please as she's showing undies when she's playing".
Hubby said no worries and didn't have a problem with it.
But it rubbed me the wrong way. I'm wondering if I'm being silly or if others have an issue with this too?
For me, it's Kindy. The only people there are her two teachers and other 4yo who aren't thinking about her undies! I've worked in Kindy's before and there's never been an issue about kids wearing dresses unless they aren't sunsmart.
I just feel like she's so young, let her play and have fun without being concerned about her clothes or other people sexualising her.
Don't get me wrong, if she lifts up her dress in public we always tell her to put it down because we don't show strangers our undies. But in a safe environment where she is being free and having fun, she shouldn't have to care about whether others can see her undies when she's climbing.
Hubby says that's why we put her in bike shorts so that she doesn't have to worry about it and she can play. It's about dignity. For me, it just rubbed me about her having to alter her body and comfort just so that others don't have to "deal" with the possibility that her dress might move while she climbs. I dunno, am I over thinking this?
It's very hot where we live and I remember as a child in primary school mum making me wear bike shorts under my school dress. I *hated* it because it was so hot and just felt like I wasn't getting airflow to that area and it would get all sweaty. I don't want her feeling the same just because a Kindy teacher has an issue with her "not being a lady!" (Not her words, just how it's translating to me)
I was raised in a conservative time for how girls dressed and I just always want my daughter to be able to wear what's comfortable and express herself how she wants.
I also don't want to just only send her in shorts to Kindy because she loves dresses.
Is it ok that Kindy teacher raised this? (Hubby has sent her in a non sunsmart dress before and nothing was every said! But this they raise?!)
I dunno, is this still necessary or is this one of the things we should leave in the past and let girls just dress how they are comfortable? Is Kindy too young to be caring about how she dresses? Should I just buy her some bike shorts because it's about dignity and teaching her protective behaviours young?
Am I over thinking this??
25 Replies
Kindy teacher is correct, covering herself and your child. You said yourself you’d correct her in public, well she’s in public but teacher can’t correct her.
She’s letting you know so you can help her from home. You don’t know what other parent or sibling is there. And youre giving her a mixed message - there’s some times or people where it’s ok to show your knickers.
Now I do believe she is safe at kindy and that’s what teachers are paid for and no, no one would be shaming her or telling her not to swing etc (that would be across the line) and I don’t think it’s wrong of her that she swings in a dress she shouldn’t be worrying about that, but you as an adult, can give it some thought, never know who is looking. It’s a valid safety concern.
What does she wear when she goes to the park to climb and play? Would she choose a dress or shorts? She needs to choose play clothes because seems she loves to play. Most schools now have skorts for this reason, but some still have dresses and skirts and it’s my opinion that no prep-2 should wear them but you still see them hanging upside down, tumbling, even sitting down, knickers on full show. It’s not a reflection on the kids but poor kids though. We do have to consider how we send them out to play, especially when we’re not there.
It’s not just that they show there undies. I used to work in kiddies and girls in skirts and dresses were often playing with themselves while sitting in story time etc. I mean where else do you put your hands? And little girl nickers often aren’t that fitting so they don’t always cover everything they should.
It’s possible the teacher is being polite by blaming it on the undies showing while playing.
Get her some little bike shorts, then she can play without having to worry and you don’t have to worry.
And yes it’s about teaching some reasonable protective behaviours.
The teacher is looking out for your child. She's not being sexist. She's not breaking any other PC women's lib rules. She's quite literally trying to keep your child safe.
A psychologist I work with took her daughter to school on her first day. A father was dropping off his child too. The father was a paedophile. She was legally not allowed to say anything because she was aware through her work and it ate her up. You don't know the background of the other parents going in and out of the kindy.... in fairness, either would the teacher. But she does know about protective measures.
This is not uncommon for kindys. When my daughter was at kindy 20 years ago they didn't like skirts or dresses at all for a few reasons. One is they are restrictive with physical play like crawling, climbing, sliding etc. The next is they are learning to sit cross legged on the mat and everything shows then. Knickers don't even cover everything if they're well used and with kids so young you can also see wet patches because they're too quick on the toilet. Do you really want other kids and adults seeing that? The other is not a nice thing to bring up and they probably wouldn't give you this as a reason but if there's a child in the class that has been SA they can sadly be very sexualized and like to grab, poke or look at other children.
Your daughter is out in the world, not at home, aren't you glad the kindy teacher is protective and looking out for her students?
This is what you want, protective caregivers when you aren't around, I'm quite surprised by your reaction.
As a former childcare educator, I loathed dresses with a passion, partially for this reason (one of the above commenters hit the nail on the head in terms of little kids undies not always properly covering the genitals). As well as that, they are so impractical and even dangerous at times (I once saw a little girl at the park have a nasty fall off a ladder because she stepped on the bottom of her dress going up it).
The centre I was at actually implemented a sun smart/play safe dress code that essentially banned dresses unless they were t-shirt or tunic styles worn with shorts or leggings.
It's not a gender thing either.
If we had a little boy who's pants were always falling down while he was running around, we'd speak to his parents about adjusting that outfit so he was comfortable and not exposing his underwear all the time. Same deal if he enjoyed wearing dresses, we'd probably ask that a little pair of shorts be worn underneath.
As a mother of two teenaged daughters, I promise you there will be times where standing up and smashing some sexist, patriarchal bullshit will be necessary. This situation ain't one of them though.
I always put black bike shorts under my girls dresses. I think it’s more comfortable and it doesn’t cover their underwear. The kindy is right and you should be happy they are looking out for her in this way. Don’t take offence to it. I’ve always got my girls to wear them.
Covers I meant
I would be happy and take peace in knowing that these teachers have your daughter in their best interest. You are thinking too much into it.
I'm also a bit curious, you say you were raised in a "conservative time", but you have a 4 year old?
When was this time because I am in my mid 40s and would say I definitely was not brought up in a conservative time.
Were you raised in another country?
She may be referring to the strict dress codes for schools of the 80s, girls couldn't wear shorts at all it was dresses or netball skirts for sports days and bloomers underneath. Parents started petitioning for different girls uniforms in the 90s to early 2000s when many public schools changed their uniforms to be more unisex and comfortable
I wore bloomers and a singlet to play basketball in 1989 in an actual basket ball competition. I used to race in bloomers and a t-shirt on sports days until about 1994 🤣 then we had to wear shorts or sports skirts.
Softball uniforms in the early 90s were bloomers too lol.
I remember wearing bloomers for basketball too but it wasn't a good thing, literally didn't have a choice it was horrible having to skip basketball because of a period or having men and boys watching you run around in undies. It proves it was a very sexist time without much choice for girls going through puberty.
It may have been all those things, but it certainly wasn't conservative. - clothes wise.
I found my dad's house was super conservative regarding certain clothes and my mum's house was conservative for others. I'm 42 this year, so slightly younger than you. I had friends who could dress in whatever they wanted, regardless of whether it was age or venue appropriate. I don't think that you need to be old or from a different culture to have had certain dressing guidelines from your parents. In addition, lots of the girls I did dancing with were in elite private schools. The dress codes they had in school were much stricter than I had.
You literally proved my point, your family were conservative, your friends, not so much.
It was not about the time at all.
I don't think a lot has changed regarding private school uniforms?
I went to a public school and as long as it was in the right colour, you could wear skirt, shorts, pants etc.
Maybe I was just lucky?
My public school wasn't that relaxed at all. We wore formal uniform unless we had sport that day or we got detention. If we had sport on the day we had parade, we had to be in formal uniform for parade and then change. If we weren't wearing the school socks, we got detention. If our jumper wasn't the school one, detention. Private schools were much stricter again because their uniform was more involved.
And I haven't proved your point at all. You made a racist assumption and forgot that there are differences between most households and that not every Australian had the exact same experiences that you did. Who cares what the OP thought was conservative in her childhood... you can't jump straight to her being an immigrant just because you didn't have conservative parents or a strict school
You must have a very romanticised view of the 80s and 90s if you think it was this super progressive and liberated era as a whole. Either that or you're blinded by nostalgia...
Sure, things may have been beginning to change but for the most part it was still a pretty conservative and sexist period in time (not to mention wildly racist and homophobic as well).
It's 2023 and I know some people, whole towns even, who are still raising their kids with value and belief systems that should've stayed in 1955.
OP feels she grew up conservatively. The end. I'm really not sure what you got out of questioning her about that?!
I’m 40 and have a 6 yr old and a newborn. Having a 4 yr old doesn’t mean she’s younger.
And we were definitely more conservative in the 80’s/90’s
I think you are thinking into it too much. Get her some little black shorts. They sell them everywhere.
You really are overthinking it and your child’s caregiver has your child’s best interests at heart. She can still wear what she wears, a pair of bike shorts won’t hurt your child. You have parents and caregivers coming and going that you know nothing about, why wouldn’t you take the teachers advice to keep your child safe at all times? Girls undies are horrible and sometimes don’t even cover what they are meant to.
Do you know every parent that attends that centre to drop off / pick up their children? It’s not just other kids and her peers that could see her.
My little girl is 3 and we are just starting toilet training. The underpants that they make for little girls are not great. They don't fit properly, if sitting cross legged they move to the side and show more then they should.
Also sand in your vagina/vulva is not very comfortable.
So I would have no problems with an educator asking that she wears bike shorts.
We always put her in bike shorts under dresses and skirts.
I found with Kindy that parents are always coming and going. They have volunteers or extra staff come in for music or gardening.
As a child I was SA at school by another child in yr 1. I always swore if I ever had a little girl she would always wear bike pants or leggings under skirts.